It could be worse…

Seems like the Reds are getting hammered a little today in the wake of the (no) trade deadline. I’ve definitely noticed the feedback from readers and have seen various media reports.

It’s understandable that people aren’t happy. There is no tangible result of the efforts Reds GM Walt Jocketty made to execute a deal and the bottom line is the Reds made no roster improvement. And because of the general lack of transperancy about talks among all GMs, we will likely never really know how close the Reds were to doing something.

Let’s be real here. The Reds are 6 1/2 games out of first place and have to leapfrog three teams to win the division. Would Ubaldo Jimenez or James Shields, pitching once every fifth day, have changed the outlook? Probably not. And that being unlikely, was it worth sending the cream of the crop in prospects (Mesoraco, Alonso or Hamilton, etc) to get one of those guys? If you’ve noticed, the Reds just won three games in a row against the Giants and picked up no games in the standings. That’s how tough the road ahead appears — with trades or not.

For whatever reason, Michael Bourn did not seem like someone the Reds should give up a lot to get. And it seems like even if the Reds produced an attractive package, the Astros were unlikely to send Bourn or Hunter Pence to a division rival.

Gutting the farm system to get any of the rental players out there would have completely undone the efforts to be long-term contenders. Had the Reds been closer to the top of hte NL Central, I would have been more aggressive. For better or worse, this is the team that has to make up a lot of ground.

As unhappy as you are about the Reds, imagine what the mood of an Astros fan is today. It’s already been a lousy year and they open a homestand tonight without the face of the franchise and an All-Star (Pence) and the leadoff hitter (Bourn). Other than Carlos Lee and Wandy Rodriguez, one would be hard-pressed to know many of the guys on the field. The players that came back in those deals are probably years away from reaching the big leagues. As Marty Brennaman might say “That’s a big ol’ hang with ’em.”

Reds lineup vs. Astros

Stubbs 8
Cairo 5
Votto 3
Phillips 4
Bruce 9
Alonso 7
Hanigan 2
Janish 6
Arroyo 1

*Just announced: Joey Votto was named NL Player of the Week.

*Of course, this is Yonder Alonso’s first big league start in LF.


Shield/Jimenez may not have gotten the Reds to playoffs this year, but another top of the rotation pitcher besides Cueto is needed before this team can make any noise in the post season. Besides the Brewers possibly, look at the other contenders to make the playoffs… you need at least two. Can Bailey be that guy? Maybe, if he can stay on the field for the whole season but that hasn’t happened yet. And being injury prone at such a young age doesn’t bode well. Is Mesoraco “untouchable”, yes. Hernandez is gone plus Mesoraco provides a much needed mid-order bat. Alonso, Hamilton, and everyone else in the FARM SYSTEM, expendable. Our team’s foundation is nearly complete and very young. It’s going to look very similar to the way it does now for the next 3 or 4 years. We got chips, use’em. Not saying go nuts but if COL and TB’s offer was slightly above what I thought was reasonable, I’d have done it.

The other major gripe is, given the low probability of the Reds making a playoff run (even w/an easy August schedule) over the remainder of the season, why in the hell wasn’t Hernandez traded to the eager Giants this weekend? He’s not coming back next season and it’s going to difficult to say the least for a trade to be done through the waiver wire. Just irresponsible in my opinion.

pitching wasn’t the problem against the phillies. it was clearly hitting

This is precisely the proper posture. Not all of us have been disappointed; some have gone so far as to defend Jockety along the lines you suggest here. I have been on the boards today trying to do that, but, as you alluded to, there’s a tsunami of opposition and despair. I’ve been saying for weeks now: Time to prepare for next year. The best way to do that is to do very little or nothing that disrupts the long range plan of the organization.

It is going to be a very interesting month. Pittsburgh, Milwauke and St. Louis all play each other 2 times each in August. If the Reds can take care of the easy August schedule they have and the other three teams beat each other up, the Reds can make a move to within 2-3 games by the end of the month. If that happens than it will be an exciting fight to the finish in September.

I agree, I’m not too worried about the Reds not making moves. They probably won’t make the playoffs this year. The Cardinals and Brewers could lose significant players this offseason and the division should be ours for the taking the next couple years with an additional top end pitcher.

Reds should have traded Lewis like they traded Gomes. He will be gone at the end of the year and Reds will have nothing to show for it. Plus would have made room to bring up Sappelt.

Same argument holds true for Hernandez. Only difference being that we could have gotten a lot more for him.

These two moves would have helped make this organization stronger.

Only move I would have made might have been sending Ramon Hernandez. But nobody probably gave the Reds much in return for him. This is a good team that has under acheived this year. However I do agree that the Reds need another big starting Arm. James Shields would have been a perfect fit. Reds have 54 games left. The way I see it…they’ll need to go 40-14 to win the Division. They’ll need to make that ground up this month for sure. GO REDS!!!!

What frustrates me is that the reds did NOTHING last winter or this July. It hurts when I hear the Cardinals GM, on Sunday night baseball, say to ythe whole country : “we made these trades to thank our fans”.

Being from Louisville I see the Bats a lot. The guys down here are the real deal and it’s not worth shipping them off for the outside chance of improving the lineup. If the Reds didn’t have 3 teams to jump it might be different. It’s going to take 90 or so wins in the Central. I can’t see us getting there without 2 10 game streaks.
The problem is untimely hitting. We’re getting plenty of quality starts. 3 or 4 runs a game just isn’t enough.
Also the Reds won a ton of close games last year. Face it. Luck plays more of a role in baseball than anyone wants to admit. We may have been lucky last year and we’re just regressing to the mean.

Urbane, self-absorbed, Toronto-bred Joey will take his amazing bat and his brooding personality elsewhere as soon as possible. To someone raised in the sophisticated whirl of the cosmopolitan Toronto, Cincinnati must seem to him like Paducah, Kentucky, does to us. Hold on to Alonso. He will have a niche for himself sooner than we’d like to think.

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